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Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel





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Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 10, 2003, 5:49 AM

Post #26 of 117 (1957 views)
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Re: [chilimson] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi chilimson,

Well I thk its the board good fortune to have a rott "exp" like U around ...! he he he ! Wink...and of course....rottzilla too ...! Tongue


U r rite abt the "backyard breeder", this a problem when the demand for the breed is high ! Its is understandable when we cannot control the so called "Ah Beng" breeder or pup millers but it is another story when we talked abt a registered breeder who breeds indiscrimnately, which is avoidable in this case.

That is why I was disussing with Rottzilla that maybe by introducing breed survey we would be able to reduce this type of indiscrimanate breeding. Of course to qualify for breed survey the dog is expected to have at least a working title.

BTW talking abt breed survey, so will U be going to chk out this coming GSDC breed survey at the end of this month, I know its not ur breed but its the next best thing.....! Wink


Quote:- ""It is interesting for you to make reference to the Austrian kennel, because I really do not think any home should own such a line without a strong commitment. ""
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I thk as long the owner is committed to socialize/train/work the pup regularly...it shouldn't be much of a problem ! hey . . .I thk there should be quite a few on board who will relish this challenge ! !


Quote :
""Vico von Flugschneise daughter, and she is a Racker von Hertener Wappen's granddaughter""
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do u happened to mean Racker vd Flugschneise ! ? Crazy , I'm still new to rott so hope U dun mind..!! BTW and what happened Vico...err...at Krg 01' ? ?Blush


Quote:
""Most of the puppies and imported from Australia or NZ because of exemption from quarantine."'
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Yes....I did noticed it as well when I m over ! it seems tht most of pet shop owner are really proud that their are imported from Aust. Actually from what my fren told me it is mostly pup mills product ! ! Frown


Quote :
""....... because of the tail issue.""
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Well its a shame really ! now more rotts of good character & temperament will be further removed from the genepool.Mad.......I thk this time the german really out-done themselves ! ! Shocked


Anyway...hope to see both U & Rottzilla keep the thread alive here !Wink

Good Luck ! Cool






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


(This post was edited by Polluxx on Nov 10, 2003, 5:53 AM)


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 11, 2003, 12:46 AM

Post #27 of 117 (1951 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rottzilla:
I'm interested with your website since polluxx said that it is one of the best site. Can u give me your URL?My email is booker_sim@hotmail.com. Thanks!Wink


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 11, 2003, 1:27 AM

Post #28 of 117 (1949 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
My point here is simple, rottweiler is a working breed, period. Therefore working lines or not, the main breeding goal is for stable nerves, even temperament & most of all good working drv, then only we look for other physical stuff.

Quote
Hi Polluxx. I'm a new Rott owner and I found that you,Chilimson and Rottzilla really give a newbie like me a good lesson to learn from.Well, I'm not so dare to give my comments in front of all expert like u all but here I've got one question.Wink
Ppl always emphasize on working line of Rottweiler but how can us, Malaysian being told that our Rott is from a working line especially if our rott is local breed? I think the most important thing that make the confusion of the Rottweiler Blood Line in our country is lack of standard regulation to control.Therefore,everybody can just easily import a Rott from any country with or without any working line.So,my opinion is,it is very difficult to tell the owner from stop getting any rottie without a working line but to set up a regulation by the association to really look into the working line for this breed if we want to inherit the wonderful nature of Rottweiler which I think we should.


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 11, 2003, 5:08 AM

Post #29 of 117 (1945 views)
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Re: [Booker] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Booker,

Glad that U can join us here, btw like U ...I m also a newbie la..! Wink


From ur post, I believe U know what U r looking for but dun seems to be able to find here ! I believe when we talk abt working line, we are talking abt breeding goal towards preserving/enhacing the working performance & temperament of the breed. So IMO, all I can say is that most of the rott bred here in M'sia is out of show/pet quality, even though they might have good working ancestor 3-4 generation back. Unsure


Quote:
""think the most important thing that make the confusion of the Rottweiler Blood Line in our country is lack of standard regulation to control. ""
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Precisely, we need a system that can control the quality of rott being bred in this country.


Quote:-
""Therefore,everybody can just easily import a Rott from any country with or without any working line""
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Do u mean working "title", well I think in this case we will just have to leave it to the individual preferance, rite ? But as for breeding, like I mentioned above, a BST which required working title as a pre-requisitive is a must ! Wink


Quote:
""So,my opinion is,it is very difficult to tell the owner from stop getting any rottie without a working line but to set up a regulation by the association to really look into the working line for this breed if we want to inherit the wonderful nature of Rottweiler which I think we should.""
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes....I'm glad there is one more person who share this tot ! ! Wink.....Smile










2ndly, I think we as a buyer should do our part/homeworks like reading up on the breed history & standard and even do some research on some of the main bloodline thru the net or by talking to the breeders !






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


chilimson
Member

Nov 11, 2003, 5:33 AM

Post #30 of 117 (1943 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Polluxx,

Thanks for the correction, it is Racker vd Flugschneise. He is out of Carlo and Lady, and was sold "accidentally" to the US because the German owner had some family problem. The Germans breeders, I heard, missed him a lot. He is sort of retired now I think from being a used as a stud, however, you can get his frozen semen for AI.

Vico attacked the judge during the Korung, as he was trying to measure his chest size. I heard that it is probably the handler mistake as well, because he had been working the dog earlier, prior to the Korung. Someone was speculating that he was not settled yet before being tested for Korung, and so the judge got "scared"Wink and Vico got dis'qd for life Pirate. Anyway, I think they all have the same aloofness, and you would have called it the Rottweiler type. Balou von Silberblick also has this problem, and people think that it must be Jackomo (Noris son). Well, there is so many Balou kids and they all have georgeous head type, and I think you are a fan of Ambassodor!Tongue

To be frank, I have had seen pretty hard Rottweilers, and honestly do not think they are suitable for too many homes. I know some Rottweiler lovers will think that I am "chicken-hearted" Laugh, but I really do not recommend them for their sake. Less they will soon be joining the dinosaurs! Mad Just look at the stupid advertisements, and what do you think your neighbours will think now?

Well, if I do find sufficient interest in strong working line, then I may consider breeding Vico's daughter. She is so determine and strong, and one of my all time favourite.


chilimson
Member

Nov 11, 2003, 5:42 AM

Post #31 of 117 (1941 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Polluxx,

I posted this in the breeding and whelping section. Please let me know what do you think?

{I do not think that eating one own weaklings or dead puppy has anything to do with bad temperament, and I will not advise of spaying or not breeding until you have really determine that the line is genetically faulty. Please remember that dogs are like domesticated "wolf" and you must think about their DNA from the past, that is before we humans own them. Believe me, they know what they are doing, even though we do not understand. I have read some of the comments and I do agree that somehow the mum do know whether the puppies will make it or not and will figure it out. There are many reasons concerning neo natal care or why puppies die and will not dwell in that subject. Please do not conclude that the bitch or dog is the problem because of this incident.

Coming back to why the bitch ate the puppy, and I do not think it is cannibalism. Some bitches are extremely protective of their young, and will "consume" them to protect them if she thinks that they will be "hurt". Thus the weaker or more nervous bitch will do that and the "bad" or stronger temperament will actually growl and protect the puppies more if they felt threaten.

I am of the opinion that the bitch consume the dead puppy because she really wanted to protect the rest of the puppies. Imagine if the puppies are borned in the wild, without human protection. First the bitch will find a special spot and dig a nest, just watch a bitch before she whelped. She will find a spot that is secluded and dig a hole so that the puppies will not wriggle out of the nest accidentally. Remember that animal in the wild are canivorous, and thus a "dead" puppy will send out sufficient scent to alert other animals in the wild that there is "food". Imagine what will a wolf, a leopard, a baboon, a vulture, etc..do when the discover the nest of one dead puppy and a few live puppies. I think that is the end of all the puppies!Wink Well...hopefully some of you will believe this story.}

Thanks for your thots!Tongue


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 11, 2003, 3:42 PM

Post #32 of 117 (1936 views)
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Re: [chilimson] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi chilimson,


Quote:-
""Someone was speculating that he was not settled yet before being tested for Korung''
---------------------------------------------------------
I may be wrong here but I tot the courage test is normally done after the physical evaluation ? Unsure Anyway, its such a shame really ! Pirate , where is he now BTW ? ?



As for ur post abt bitch cannibalism of their dead pup, well I've not done any breeding so I'm not too sure what I thk of it. But if the pup is very weak (almost dying)) or dead, than I'm of the opinion that the bitch do it for the greater chance of survival for the rest of the pup , i.e she will get more nourishment from the pup she consumed and will be able to feed
the remaining litter better. 2ndly the remaining litter will will have less competion for the milks & also greater chance of survival ! Wink so its not such a bad thing after all ! ! Cool


Maybe others on board who has experience can share their tot on what they think of this ! ! Wink






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


(This post was edited by Polluxx on Nov 11, 2003, 3:45 PM)


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 11, 2003, 7:32 PM

Post #33 of 117 (1924 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hello Poluxx,

We had a meeting with the CM of MKA on last Sunday which confirmed our 4th Rottweiler Speciality show will be held on December,Ipoh !!


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 11, 2003, 7:42 PM

Post #34 of 117 (1923 views)
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Re: [chilimson] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Chilimson,

Do you Know Mr Ang Ngoh Eng of your country who is quite actively involevd in the dog show in 90's ?
Is he still active in the show ? I used to co-owned a dog name Bomber Vom Aggetal (Son of Axel Aus Der Hege ) from him .Do you know anything about Bomber while he was in Singapore ?


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 12, 2003, 3:43 AM

Post #35 of 117 (1912 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi rottzilla,

So where have U been for the last few days ? Wink


Quote:-
""which confirmed our 4th Rottweiler Speciality show will be held on December,Ipoh"'
---------------------------------------------------------
Will it be ADRK judge this time ..? Wink


Anywhere, when is the actual date ? maybe U can post the actual date & the venue for the show in the the "Show & Championship" section . Tongue






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


chilimson
Member

Nov 12, 2003, 6:13 AM

Post #36 of 117 (1908 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rottzilla,

I have bought a dog from him a puppy before I started to learn anything about bloodline and pedigree. He old me a dog that grew "beard" over the chin, and long hair grow underneath all his four feet. At that time, I did not understand that the dam who is a long coat would produce similar genetic coat problem. The stud is his own dog from Belgium, and I foget his name now. He had not been showing Rottweilers for more than6 years already, and there are so many rumours that I do not think it is appropriate to write here as I am not sure about the real story.

Sorry, I cannot answer your question as I think he is not active in SKC as well.


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 12, 2003, 7:28 PM

Post #37 of 117 (1901 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

 


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 12, 2003, 7:47 PM

Post #38 of 117 (1901 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hello Poluxx,

I went to the north visited a few 'kaki' and having discussion about the coming speciality show !! Wink
Shameful to say,we don't have the supremacy to choose a judge !!MadMad It's all up to MKA to decide.Most probably is from Australia again.Unsure But I will propose the ADRK judges to them again for the speciality show for next year .
The actual date will be on 21th Dec 2003 and will be held at the Polo Club,Ipoh. I think is the best venue compared with the previous speciality show !!Sly


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 12, 2003, 8:05 PM

Post #39 of 117 (1899 views)
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Re: [chilimson] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Chilimson,

Sorry for your grieved experience !!Frown


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 12, 2003, 8:16 PM

Post #40 of 117 (1899 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi polluxx, I know u r not a newbie ok since u have many years experience in GSD.I admit that I'm too rush to get my first puppy before I collect sufficient info on this breed but I believe ppl learn from mistake rite, and I promise myself that the next puppy that I'm going to get must be the standard breed.By than,I'll surely get the advice from you,Chilimson and Rottzilla.
By the way, if I'm not mistaken,I think you are from Northern rite?Which part of northern?I'm from Butterworth so may visit your dog if u allows to.You can send me ur address to my personal email booker_sim@hotmail.com if you don't want to post your personal particular on the forum.


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 12, 2003, 9:48 PM

Post #41 of 117 (1893 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rottzilla,so happy to hear that there will be another rott show in Dec.Will try to spare my time for this round. So, are you going to show your dog for this time?
By the way,what is your home page address?Really wish to have a look on your rottie.If you don't mind will be appreciated if you can email it to my personal email at booker_sim@hotmail.com.Thx


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 12, 2003, 10:48 PM

Post #42 of 117 (1890 views)
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Re: [Booker] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hello Booker,

I've just email my web address to you !! Please check your mail box !!


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 12, 2003, 11:13 PM

Post #43 of 117 (1885 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi rottzilla,

Thanx for the info.

Quote :- ""we don't have the supremacy to choose a judge !!MadMad It's all up to MKA to decide.Most probably is from Australia again.""

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Darn....! so we can have SV judge here but not ADRK... one..! ! What kind bloody policy is that...! ! Mad even though I'm not into show...but I can feel the frustration ! !

Hopefully they will change their mind in the future for the good of the breed...!! Pirate

BTW . . .did U proposed having a BST (+ working trial)....? ? any luck ? Shocked






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 12, 2003, 11:15 PM

Post #44 of 117 (1884 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks Rottzilla,I've viewed your site.Wow.....u really got most of the nice champion blood line.I like Amstel very much......such a beutiful "Lady"!!Wink


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 12, 2003, 11:34 PM

Post #45 of 117 (1881 views)
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Re: [Booker] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Booker,

I thk U mistaken me wt someone else....la LOL Laugh Laugh , I'm from Jhr and my interest wt GSD & Rott started only in the recent yrs !! Wink

BTW I dun thk U made any mistake la !. . . maybe U should say U got carried way in your desire to own a rott. Well since U alredi got one...enjoy & learn from it , just like wht I m doing wt my GSD ! Cool

Maybe in the future, if u do decided to get one more...U can always chk wt chilimson, rotzilla & others on board. Of course I will do what I can to assist as well ! Tongue

BTW...hope u dun mind me asking this question, well since U r into rott....R u interested wt working trial kinda of stuff ? Blush






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


Booker
Dog Kichi


Nov 12, 2003, 11:56 PM

Post #46 of 117 (1879 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hahaha......I'm so careless Polluxx, I thought I seen you telling some other member that u r from Northern...soli soli....


Quote
Maybe in the future, if u do decided to get one more...U can always chk wt chilimson, rotzilla & others on board. Of course I will do what I can to assist as well ! Tongue


Yeah......I learn a lot of thing from Chilimson and he is so kind to teach me. Really appreciate that very much!!


Quote
BTW...hope u dun mind me asking this question, well since U r into rott....R u interested wt working trial kinda of stuff ? Blush



Not quite understand what do u mean by Working Trial since I'm such a newbieTongue
Let me try to answer ur question. I think at this moment I'm not really suitable to work my rottie since there is lack of compound near my house.Besides,I don't have any experience in working a rottie.However,this will be my another mission to work my rottie.


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 13, 2003, 2:13 AM

Post #47 of 117 (1871 views)
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Re: [Booker] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hello Booker,

Thanks for your compliments !!

In Reply To
I admit that I'm too rush to get my first puppy before I collect sufficient info on this breed but I believe ppl learn from mistake rite, and I promise myself that the next puppy that I'm going to get must be the standard breed.



A world renowed Rottweiler judge Mr Josef Hedl had a famous remark , he said....Always find something good about your dog,all dogs have problems,some a little more than others,but there are always something good to find in a dogs !! And you must always live with the good feeling about your dog.Unimpressed

Don't be so dejected about your first Rott !! As long as the pup has good temperament,then will be good enough !!


rottzilla
Novice

Nov 13, 2003, 2:40 AM

Post #48 of 117 (1869 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hello Poluxx,

I did proposed to them with the Swedish Dog Mentality Assessment ( DMA ),and I've made a copy of VCD for them, I hope they will really consider this time !!Wink About the bite work for the working trial, I think this is not the right time to proceed, we have to proceed it gradually because our beloved breed still give many ppl very bad impressions,Unsureyou get what I mean ? Are you planning to take a view for the coming speciality show ?


chilimson
Member

Nov 13, 2003, 4:14 AM

Post #49 of 117 (1865 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rottzilla,

I agree with you about looking at the positive side of every dog we own. Actually, I have kept every dog or puppy that I purchased, even though they did not turn out to be the ideal dog. Every dog has its own beauty and so I encourage everyone to learn. I have spent a lot of money and time to learn about the breed as well as the breeders. I am glad that there are really serious Rottweiler owners at this forum, and I hope they will help to preserve the Rottweiler in Malaysia.

By the way, the puppy I bought from Ang actually died of heartworm, and so I have now been feeding my dogs monthly "Heartgard-plus".


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Nov 13, 2003, 4:15 AM

Post #50 of 117 (1864 views)
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Re: [rottzilla] Rottweiler - Cliff v.d. konigskanzel [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rottzilla,

Quote:
""we have to proceed it gradually because our beloved breed still give many ppl very bad impressions""
--------------------------------------------------------
Well lets just say I understand the chapter's concern, but in DMA other than the gunshot I dun thk it will be sufficient enuf to weed out the weaker nerve one....of course they do have the "ghost" to scare off the weaker one...LOL LaughLaugh..! !

The way I see it, only the sociability of the dog is tested,...., what abt stable nerve & working drive ? ?Shocked

Actually I was hoping at least for Ztp/Korung or even Swiss' Wesens-Test type for a start, then followed by a working trial ! ! Unsure


BTW I hope U dun misunderstand my intention, I would really like to commend U for your efforts in trying to persuade ur "kaki" to introduce BST here..!! Wink...all I m hoping for really is for a more substantial test .....! Blush


Anyway I hope they will take up ur suggestion for start & for our breed sake hopefully things will further improve for the better in future...! Unimpressed


As for going to the show....I dun think so la ! , err...Ipoh is a bit far la...! ! Tongue






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


(This post was edited by Polluxx on Nov 13, 2003, 4:43 AM)

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