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Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP







comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 15, 2005, 8:18 PM

Post #1 of 21 (5773 views)
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Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP Can't Post

Could someone please give me a professional advice as to what to do.

I have a medium build dog who has a fear of thunder and other startling noises like firecrackers & grass cutters. I've read many articles reading dog's behavior and I know it's an anxiety but unfortunately this has led to him being destructive and sometimes caused injury upon himself esp. when noone is home. I have tried to provide him a safe place inside the house to hide during the storms etc but its not working at all. Distracting the dog with his favourite toys and snacks don't work either. I hear that desensitization techniques works but unfortunately I work during the day and I won't be able to give him this kinda theraphy training. I know obedience classes will not make your dog less afraid of thunder or other noises, but it could help boost her general confidence. Again I can't find the training time accomodating to my packed schedule..sigh* I've asked my vet regarding this but he can't seem to give me any good answers and solutions. It's as good as not asking. I have to admit my dog has severe fears and phobias and perhaps an animal behavior specialist would work?

Other issues also occur like separation anxiety. I currently just moved out from my parents place (whom are not too keen on keeping him) to my own. I'm giving him (my dog) sometime to get acquainted to the place n settle down. So far he's been a darling and doing alright. It's just that I can't leave him alone at home without him barking and be destructive especially when it rains and there's noone to comfort him. I was told many times to give him up for adoption and believe me, it had crossed my mind like a million times. But that would be the last resort but I'd like to find out whether there are anyone else out there with such a dilema as I am in now. Are there such things as doggy day care centres in Malaysia where they provide socialization and basic training perhaps. I've grown really attached to my dog but when I think about it, I think giving him a home to an experienced person/s who has handled such cases.. knows how care for him and give him plenty of affection and time would be the greatest. At least he don't have to fight his anxiety and fear alone in the house the whole day for like 9.5hrs. Besides its good that he will have time to socialize with other dogs. I don't want him to end up in a home where they do not know how to handle him when he's afraid, cos I think he needs that special attention. I can't seem to find after moving out from my parents place.

If anyone can help me in my dilema please do give me some ideas.. A happy dog is a happy owner :)

Thanks in advance!


hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Feb 16, 2005, 12:17 PM

Post #2 of 21 (5754 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi

I don't know if this would apply to your dog but thought perhaps you might benefit from my experience on my 2 dogs which has thunder phobia.

in my opinion obedience clases does help boost a dog's confidence, but i doubt it will help much with conquering the fear of thunder and other noises. most often even the most well-trained dogs are unable to cope with their thunder phobia and at some cases they tend to get distructive like any other dogs. proper socialization also will not help much with tending your dog's phobia. well socialized dogs too will find themselves shivering and hiding under beds when a storm is coming. socializations only lets a dog get used to other dogs and humans, it doesn't tend to a dog's fear of thunder.

my golden retriever used to suffer from a rather serious thunder phobia and fire crackers phobia last time. it only happened when he was well after a year old. he is a confident dog himself, but he cowers with fear, body all tensed and shivers a LOT when he hears thunder or firecrackers. he would stick to us like glue when there's a thunder storm.

i wanted to fix the problem so that he'd have no problems in future if there is no one at home during a thunder storm sometime. the good thing is he wasn't destructive, he's just terribly scared. like you have tried, toys and snacks do not help at all as he is too worried about the sound. i also read that hugging and reassuring them might not be a good idea as they'd accustom that as a praise for fearing the thunder and it will only reinforce the behavior. i didn't want him to hide either as there are extreme cases that desperate dogs squeeze themselves behind shelves and awfully cramp places out of fear when there is no place for them to hide. it is dangerous (might get stucked) when no one is around.

i had enough and i decided to let him face the fear instead of letting him avoid it. it might sound cruel, but here's how i did it. during thunder storms i confine him outside at our backyard (well shaded from rain of course). all items were cleared in the backyard to make sure he doesn't hurt himself. i would just go about with my business in the kitchen where he could see me through the gate. i ignore his constant banging and scratching on the gate and make sures he does not sense that i'm scared of thunder myself. i would acknowledge him by talking to him, but no touching or hugging or letting him in until storm is over. if you let the dog in mid-storm the dog wins a point and learn that by banging or relying on you he will gain entry and the problem will not be solved.

after a few (actually MANY) sessions he got less tensed as he is more accustomed with the noise. then i would go out of his sight and do my business. ocassionally i would pop in the kitchen and make sure he sees me. same goes for firecrackers. i just leave him outside when it's CNY season.

after few months there is no more shivering or hiding and he is in the house, sleeping soundly even with the sound of thunder. during CNY he barks at fireworks and firecrackers (which is starting to get annoying to the neighbours) do remember though it will be very hard to totally cure the problem as the phobia might just come back if there is a *serious* storm someday. It will also happen if any family member is suddenly "shocked" by loud thunder sometimes. The fear will then pass down to the dog and the cycle repeats itself again.

perhaps some people might not agree with my method here as it might sound cruel itself. but IMHO the one of the solution to cure the fear is to face the fear, not avoid it. avoiding it is only a temporary solution. this method works best for confident dog (not the really submissive ones, ie pee when scared). most importantly, this method is not a one size fits all method, only consider this if you have tried all other options and think your dog can deal with the fear without hurting himself. a dog can also be leashed to keep him from bumping into walls or injuring himself. there should always be human supervision.

there are also methods like playing a tape of thunder noise and loud rock music to let the dog curb the fear but obviously most dogs are smart enough to differenciate a real thunder from a recorded tape.

right now my 2nd dog has the same phobia, she is very afraid of fireworks and would hide under my bed everytime (would even bite if you try to get her out from there). i have also placed her outside the backyard during CNY. she still seems worried, but at least nowshe would run out to the garden to check out the fireworks once in a while.

sounds like you love your dog a lot. give him time to get his phobia cured as it'd definitely be a waste if a dog is given away for being afraid of something. understand that you might not be able to tend to him all the time, but just try to have someone with him if possible to deal with the problem once and for all. the longer you allow this the more serious problem you'll face and the harder it will be to fix the problem.

sorry for this awfully long winded post. it's just that i can relate to you and it is very heart aching to see our dogs being so afraid at raining seasons! whichever method you try, i wish you and your dog all the best.


comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 16, 2005, 6:36 PM

Post #3 of 21 (5746 views)
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Re: [hunter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi there Hunter

Thx so much for your response. I've spoken to quite a number of my friends whose dog has this fear too. Lucky for them their lil darlings were not as destructive as mine. I gonna start my dog on sound theraphy,.. playing thunder n rain noises softly n increasing the sounds over a period of time. afterall i think i need to give him a chance to overcome this fear.

yeah i agree training will not work as much either but no harm trying again.. at least he won't tear the house down (hopefully)

last time i put my dog out during cny too. he was freaked out. i let him be n he was barking n barking like forever. u know how mean some neighbours are esp if we have malays next door. so just afraid they might get annoyed so after a few mins i put him in. he was so exhausted from the barking he went to sleep lol! but of course that didnt help.. sigh*

but it's really good to hear that your dog overcame his fears... maybe i should send mine to you for training ahahha!!!

well, it's been really comforting knowing that someone else out there has the same prob as I do. sometimes the dog tests me up to a limit i think i'll go insane 1st b4 he does Tongue thanks for the advice. i really appreciate it.

btw, some friends tell me that maybe getting another dog would work as he will be socialized more and the other dog can somewhat comfort him??? does this really work???


(This post was edited by comet on Feb 16, 2005, 6:37 PM)


hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Feb 16, 2005, 9:07 PM

Post #4 of 21 (5737 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

getting another dog would work if you're sure that the other dog is NOT afraid of any thunder or noise.

if not, the fear will pass down to the second dog by the first dog. you will have double the problem as you are having now!


comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 17, 2005, 6:01 PM

Post #5 of 21 (5710 views)
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Re: [hunter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

do you know of any trainer or anyone who can help me train for such a problem. i find it so difficult to find enough time at home to do any training myself. I was wondering like sending him to a boarding school (lol*) to get some training.. is there such a thing. if there is then i don't have to resort into giving him to another family who has the time and energy & patience for such.

thx!


comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 17, 2005, 9:34 PM

Post #6 of 21 (5700 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

I tried some tricks last night with my dog. he was getting fearful from the never ending firecrackers that was going on last night. my husband & I pretended nothing was happening & instead played ball n made him run about in the garden. he loves going for walks so we ran about with this leash in your hand.. :) well it worked a while. we had to distract him like so many times. we even took a nice stroll outside... mind ya it's midnight n i shold say ppl should be sleeping Laugh

anyways, after an hour we got tired, hot and sweaty and we went back in. turned on the radio to muffle the sound of distant crackers. nothing seems to work still. after a hard day at work,.. patience kinda wearing thin. it's those moments where you wanna yank your own hair out not knowing what it is you can do for your dog.. despite how much you love him... sigh*

ok dog wins.. slept in the room with us again last night.
he's such a baby.


hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Feb 17, 2005, 11:50 PM

Post #7 of 21 (5695 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

for this case IMO a dog trainer wouldn't be much of a help as it's behavior problem of the dog and disciplining it would not help much in overcoming his fear.

i think as you mentioned before an animal behaviorist should be the more appropriate person to hire but unfortunately here in Malaysia i don't know if there is anyone who would deal with this type of problem :/ in the states though u can easily hire from dog behaviorist who would visit your house and fix the problem.

yesterday's fireworks was terrible everywhere. even the noisiest dogs in the neighbourhood were awfully quiet, lol, so you are not alone when it comes to extreme fireworks or storm. it all happens with other dogs as well.

i know it's heart wrenching, but don't give up hope! i would suggest you try to give more time with your dog and who knows you might see a change within the next few months? if really you are unable to cope with the problem then i guess the last resort would be to let him get adopted by someone else capable of handling him (which i highly highly highly do not recommend :p)


comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 18, 2005, 12:17 AM

Post #8 of 21 (5690 views)
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Re: [hunter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah, I'm resorting the rehoming him to the very VERY last resort. Think I love him too much to give him away to someone who can help him overcome his fears. Despite him being so destructive.

Anyway, I've read up on this D.A.P (Dog Appeasing Pheromone Electric Diffuser) device online. It's suppose to Calms dogs during thunderstorms, fireworks, visits by strangers, or moving to a new home etc. Have you heard of such a device or whether it works?? If it does I don;t mind investing in 1 as part of his training :) Too bad malaysia pet stores or vets are not well equipped like overseas..

oh no heavy rain now... my poor dog!! he must be terrified at home Pirate


hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Feb 20, 2005, 8:11 AM

Post #9 of 21 (5656 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

sorry, i haven't heard of DAP before. do you have a link to the product? if u do get one later, do let me know if it works, would help malaysian dogs in future, lol.

good luck with the training. hope your dog cope his phobia soon!


comet
Dog Kichi


Feb 21, 2005, 8:58 PM

Post #10 of 21 (5630 views)
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Re: [hunter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Got this from a website :-

What is D.A.P.™?
Developed for pet owners by veterinarians, D.A.P.™ (Dog Appeasing Pheromone) mimics the properties of the natural pheromones of the lactating female. Within three to five days after giving birth, the female generates pheromones that give their puppies a sense of well-being and reassurance, known as appeasing pheromones.

How is D.A.P.™ used?
D.A.P.™ is an easy-to-use "plug-in" diffuser that consists of an electrical plug-in unit and disposable (30-day) bottle that will deliver the pheromone 24 hours a day. It continuously releases the active ingredient into the dog's environment and allows trouble-free treatment in a 650-square-foot area for approximately four weeks.

How can D.A.P.™ calm dogs in stressful situations?
Pheromones are picked up and detected by an animal's sense of smell producing specific responses. By replicating this signal of comfort, D.A.P.™ helps alleviate fear and stress related signs in the puppy and adult dog.

How long should D.A.P.™ be used?
To address behavior caused by temporary events, plug the diffuser in for 30 days. Each vial attached to a diffuser lasts approximately four weeks. Repeat as necessary.

How well does D.A.P.™ work?
In clinical trials with D.A.P.™, destructive behavior and vocalization (excessive barking and whining) were improved or resolved by 72 percent and 85 percent respectively. (Clinical trials were conducted by Ceva Sante Animale between November 1999 and November 2000, and were under the specific direction of Dr. Patrick Pageat.)

Does D.A.P.™ have any effect on cats?
D.A.P.™ is a chemical copy of the canine appeasing pheromones in lactating females. The pheromones are species-specific and should not have any effect on cats. The product has not been tested on cats.

What does it smell like?
D.A.P.™ has no smell and is odorless to humans when dry.

Is it a sedative?
No, D.A.P.™ is a solution that helps calm and reassure puppies and adult dogs.

Should any precautions be taken with pets and children?
Proper product use will not harm children, adults or pets. Plug diffusers into electric sockets in an open area most frequented by the dog. Do not place behind furniture.

Ref. Sites:
http://www.healthypets.com/dapdogappher.html
http://www.tjspetshop.com/itemPage.php?sku=66428


Gus-Gus
Canine Addict

Mar 10, 2005, 8:13 PM

Post #11 of 21 (5576 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi. I don't know if this is of any help but I watched a programme on Animal Planet (Barking Mad) that featured a dog that was terrified of loud bangs and noises like thunder.

The owner was very soothing and kind to the dog when there were loud noises and IT WAS THE WRONG THING TO DO! According to the therapist who was brought in to try and resolve the problem, the soothing and gentle treatment only reinforced the dog's shaking and fear reaction. Hunter's solution of ignoring the dog and its shaking and nervous behaviour is exactly the course of action the dog therapist suggested and it worked - at least so it seemed at the end of that programme. Missed the later programme with the follow up.......

I've had various dogs over the years that disliked thunder and loud bangs. I'm fairly sure it was passed on by my own reaction to thunder and the loud crack from lightning. Now, if I'm at home when it starts to thunder and there is ligthning, if it is feasible, I go to bed and lie there like I'm having a nap. My dogs' love crawling into bed with me so now they think that thunder and lightning is a signal for nap-time. They're so cool about the loud noises that it soon soothes me. Oh, the wonders of dogs.

Hope that helps.


"The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated" Mahatma Ghandi.


comet
Dog Kichi


Mar 11, 2005, 8:13 PM

Post #12 of 21 (5556 views)
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Re: [Gus-Gus] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

I got this crate for my dog and I turned one of the rooms into his room. I put the crate in there and leaves him in when it rains n thunders... or when he just wanna sleep... Cos I dun wanna associate thunder = go into crate. anyways he will bark n scratch but after a while he settles down and I can see a good change in his behaviour. I believe he's coping better with thunder and startling sounds.. A friend told me it's not an overnight thingie so I'm gonna wait and see if he improves up to the point where he just don't care when it rains n just snooze...

Thanks for the response....


kenken
Dog Kichi


Mar 22, 2005, 6:53 PM

Post #13 of 21 (5529 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

You can also simulate the loud noises by turning up the volume of a radio. Smile


alana
Novice


May 30, 2006, 7:46 PM

Post #14 of 21 (5182 views)
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Re: [kenken] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

perhaps the sound of the thunder is like how many times louder to a dog's ear. same goes for firecrackers.

my sunshine was pretty destructive when i left her at home last time. she'll go through the shoe rack, toilet paper rolls, cushion. i resorted to keeping all things off the floor when i have to leave her home alone and give her the 'kong' stuffed with peanutbutter to distract her. when i left the house, she was happily licking away the kong oblivious to leaving the house and by time i got back, no doubt the peanut butter was all gone but there's no signs of destructions but she was sitting on the sofa looking out the window waiting for me to return.


potter
Member


Feb 9, 2007, 12:21 PM

Post #15 of 21 (4806 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

I have heard of D.A.P. and I have some yorkie forum friends using it. According to their experience, it work very well. Their dogs will usually be more relax when they leave for work. Just remember not to plug the device in a socket behind a furniture. I am looking to getting one for my baby too as he has problem with me going out each and every time.
potter

www.dogster.com/pet_page.php?j=t&i=410379


shusakakenzo
New User

Jun 26, 2007, 1:18 AM

Post #16 of 21 (4614 views)
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Re: [potter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

hi...i have similar problems too but i think mine is more severe coz i leave with housemates and they cant stand the dog anymore. therefore time is a constraint for me. if i have my own house, at least i can tolerate it and slowly train her myself.

she had scratched most of the door paint out..scratched housemates car, jump to neighbours compound, break fence and the last straw was when she broke the glass sliding door to pieces. i am hoping i can try to train her myself but can only do so on weekends and after work but that if also there are thunderstorms during that time. most of the thunderstorms happen while i am working, so everytime i get a call or msg from housemates who were already back home after a thunderstorm, i know i am already in trouble.

i luv the dog a lot and has grown fondly attached with her and enjoy weekends strolling in the park with her but due to her behaviour my housemates is asking the dog to go. i am wondering is there a shelter home for dogs for 1-2 years or any kind soul who love dogs who might want to adopt her for 1-2 years coz my new home can only be ready after that. i cant afford to lose this dog actually. any solutions out there? thanks a million.


zephyros
Canine Addict


Oct 24, 2007, 10:25 PM

Post #17 of 21 (4270 views)
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Re: [potter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

works well. but my question is, will this be a permanent solution? or just a temporary? meaning will the owner need to keep using it? or will the dog slowly learn to remain calm when it's noisy?


potter
Member


Oct 25, 2007, 3:55 PM

Post #18 of 21 (4260 views)
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Re: [zephyros] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

You didn't state what you were asking to be permanent/temporary. If you are refering to D.A.P, it needs to be used continuously because only when you use it, it releases canine appeasing pheromones and that pheromones help to calm dogs down so once you don't use it, no pheromones are being released hence nothing to provide a sense of well-being and reassurance which is what pheromones does. It could be viewed as a permanent solution only that you have to continue using it. If you are lazy to train your dog or what we call desensitization training, this could be the best method for a permanent solution or D.A.P. could be used together with the desensitization training to help your dog.

If an owner do not want to continuously buy D.A.P., you can desensitize your dog. It takes time and patience to train which differs from dog to dog and you have to have the thunder tape recording and play it starting from real low volume. While playing the thunder sound, get your dog to do sit, down, come (of course provide treats each time). When a dog is busy doing things and being rewarded by treats, they are likely to not focus on the soft thunder sound playing behind. Slowly, turn up the sound a little more and do the same exercise (sit, down, come, etc). Repeat the exercise by turning the sound louder. If it gets too loud to a point, turn it back down a little and when he seems okay, tune up a little again. This might take days, weeks but eventually, this is a permanent solution. It is too cruel to force your dog to deal with it outside on its own. Try to do this at home gradually with some understanding and help from the owner. If your dog seems too be scared, the last thing you want to do is patting/reassuring him coz you are rewarding its behaviour of being scared to the thunder.

Good luck with whichever way you choose.
potter

www.dogster.com/pet_page.php?j=t&i=410379


zephyros
Canine Addict


Oct 25, 2007, 5:22 PM

Post #19 of 21 (4253 views)
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Re: [potter] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

ic. well those who has this problem with their dog you can try this as temporary solution i guess. in the long run i'd say diligent training will pay off. Good luck!


PSY
K9 Kaki


Oct 25, 2007, 7:31 PM

Post #20 of 21 (4250 views)
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Re: [shusakakenzo] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi, not sure if this would help, what I do is when my litter is weaned they are crated either together or individually, (depending on the size of the crate) put them in my sitting room and watch a movie ..... well put a movie on with lots of explosion and gun fire thru the home theather system and see their reaction. Those that are steady will be in individual creates those not will be with their siblings. After a couple of weeks you will find them either sleeping or playing with all the loud noise around them.


zephyros
Canine Addict


Nov 13, 2007, 12:56 AM

Post #21 of 21 (4066 views)
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Re: [comet] Fear of Thunder and other Startling Noises ~HELP [In reply to] Can't Post

hi comet. for your request i've tried and managed to get two DAP's in. BUT unfortunately they are a little on the pricey side. 24.99 each, and shipping from the USA about usd38. which brings it to about usd43.99. if you're still interested let me know. if not i'll just let it go to others but please do let me know soon too. Thanks.

 
 




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