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Beauty & Brains





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Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 21, 2008, 12:51 AM

Post #26 of 60 (2574 views)
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Re: [PSY] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Absolutely agree with you! That was what the quote meant... I really believe all dogs should be trained.


chrisong
Doggyman

Feb 21, 2008, 4:05 AM

Post #27 of 60 (2563 views)
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Re: [PSY] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

"Not all people have time" mean me?

I only dislike the way committee members handle thing not MKA. Overall MKA image are so bad in many MKA member eyes. They should accept critics & buck-up and do something about it. By not listening to MKA members complain & trying to avoiding thing its not going to help clear their bad image.


chrisong
Doggyman

Feb 21, 2008, 4:28 AM

Post #28 of 60 (2561 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

  

In Reply To
Dogs are dogs. They were not made as fashion accessories or as trophies. "They were made for a purpose". This is what I'm trying to tell you.

Sorry I very lazy read your long message here. I didn't say training is not IMPORTANT!!! I just say not everyone have the time to train their dog. THAT IT!!! AIYOCrazy Ask you questions based on the above statement. Since you mention in your first & second post you should train your dog what they were breed for. Few questions for u. What is the purpose of a GR Dog Breed? Are GR/Dogs suppose to be breed & train in doing dancing & entertain human being? Use them as a tool to generate income? Is that mean in all adoption puppy/dog section Admin should include "TRAINING YOUR DOG A MUST TO ALL ADOPTER"? I think chances the puppy/dog being adopted a so low many will end up dead. Good luck to Amber.Faith breeding beauty with brain GR. Hope to hear more about you in future. Good luck to PSY. hmmmm.....wat ar? become MKA president lah. Last post to you & PSY. No point continue discussion but I still continue replying few post. DAMN it.Unsure Really take up alot of my time in internet replying. Better use the time spend with my dogs.


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 21, 2008, 6:45 AM

Post #29 of 60 (2551 views)
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Re: [chrisong] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Chrisong, I'm quite tired of explaining & replying some more lah. I really need a break at least for a while but I will rely this one bit. Like I said in one of my replies. GRs are bred to retrieve ducks BUT since Malaysia don't practice this sport, what to do? Train OB. Malaysia has a few dog sports to offer so do those sports instead. Well like I said, owners decision. If they want to train then GREAT! But if no, what can we do? So, now you get it? This whole post was actually to advice owners to train their dogs. These kind of posts is very important especially to those who are thinking of getting a dog. I noticed when it comes to these kind of educating posts, no one will reply. Instead, they will go to the adoption forum to look for a dog not wanting to learn the important facts of owning a dog 1st. Malaysians are like this half past six. Not willing to learn, not willing to listen. You see, who's replying this post only? You, Acsyen & PSY. The active ones ONLY! I was hoping that new members who are still learning about dogs or who are gonna get a dog reply to this post to learn more about owning a dog & that to know that training is very important. Well, I guess they all just want to get a dog for what purpose? I have no idea. What to do you tell me?????? I'm quite disappointed. I think I'm just really wasting my time & breath explaining. I wish Malaysians change their mindsets & attitudes about owning dogs. Dogs are like children & they need the same requirements & infact everything that a child needs in its life till it grows up.


(This post was edited by Amber.Faith on Feb 21, 2008, 7:01 AM)


robros
K9 Maniac


Feb 21, 2008, 11:41 PM

Post #30 of 60 (2526 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Amber.Faith,

I absolutely agree with you in terms of training. VERY VERY important. Used to have 2 rottweilers and having breed such a rottie, cannot emphasis more on the importance of OB training. If not may get famous in the papers; rottweiler attack!, etc, etc.

The dogs also thrives on OB training and it brings the owners closer to their dogs. Dogs are very much like children. Need to know/understand the clear instructions, expectations, boundaries, limitations and who is the alpha leader, etc, etc.

When I took my rotties for OB training & puppy.com get together previously, a couple of times they were attacked by other dogs such as min pins, maltese, etc. I am proud to say that despite being bitten, they did not retaliate. You can imagine the consequences of a retaliation by a rottie!

Pity when I strongly advised the owners of these sakai dogs (so out of control despite their small size), the owners had the cheek to tell me that rotties should be banned from public events...as if my dogs did something wrong.

No need to get so heated up lor. We are all dog lovers but have different opinions on the way to manage our fur-kids but we do have one common love - dogs.


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 22, 2008, 5:10 AM

Post #31 of 60 (2514 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Amber,

sorry to interrupt.. do you know why nobody is answering?? cause don't want to involve ourself into both of your debate.. ( I don't know what other people's thinkingbut for me, if I see people debating.. I won't say anything until they end their debating.. :)). So, please don't blame others for not replying your post.. :)

by the way, sending our furkid to OB is good for both the dog and us.. cause this class will let the owner know how to communicate with the dog.. but, we'll need to spend time practising with our furkid, if not after attending the class also no effect at all.. and all of these, need TIME..

anyway, my furkid will attend her first OB class this coming Sunday.. :) don't know how she'll react.. hope that she's fine.. :)


(This post was edited by mickey123 on Feb 22, 2008, 5:12 AM)


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 22, 2008, 6:37 AM

Post #32 of 60 (2506 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah true...Well, gotta have debates sometimes right. Everybody will have their own opinions & thinking. Training is part of responsible ownership too. I just hope new owners will consider bringing their dogs for training. They will realize how wonderful the pet can be when it's trained. Ofcourse, don't stop in the middle of basic or pupy class lah. The dog has not learned anything yet! Atleast reach up to Pre-Novice & then they can see the difference in their dogs & they can feel proud of their dogs especially after what the dog has achieved (eg: new command) People who say training is not so important or what good is training for, they don't know becoz they have not tried it yet. Once they do, they will really know & understand what I'm trying to say here. Anyway, will see you & your pup this Sunday. Going for puppy or basic class? How old is she? Remember to bring lots of cold water for her as it'll be quite hot there. Wait, you'll be training your pup at Taman Desa is it?


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 22, 2008, 6:46 AM

Post #33 of 60 (2504 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

oh.. no.. I'm not taking her to Tmn Desa.. cause I'm staying in Ipoh..

I'll go to the YWCA, Ipoh for training.. it's organized by the..

I went to the training centre last Sunday, and talked to the trainer already.. He asked me to bring my furkid this Sunday for the class.. so, sorry.. you won't be seeing me in Tmn Desa until my furkid finishes her training (10 weeks).. I can't travel until she finishes her training.. Frown so, need to stay in Ipoh for this coming 10 weekends.. I will bring her go travelling again after her training... (I used to travel to KL or Penang during weekends --- not every weekends, but quite often --- cause my brother and sister are staying there). So, you won't be seeing me in Tmn Desa this weekends..

I will bring my furkid to KL again after she finishes her training. I might join the Saturday morning Gasing Hill dog gathering if I were there.. so, see ya..


oops.. forget to tell you.. my furkid is a black female lab, 6 months plus.


(This post was edited by mickey123 on Feb 22, 2008, 6:54 AM)


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 22, 2008, 8:03 AM

Post #34 of 60 (2496 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Oh okay! Well, I just hope her training goes well. One important thing for you to know, be consistent on everything. If she does something wrong, immediately correct her. Praising is so so so important! So anything she does right & pleases you, praise her in a happy tone. Giving treats or toys as rewards is good. But if she's not motivated by either of those two, praising will do but remember, praising has got to be very enthusiastic. Just a piece of my two cents. Good luck with her training! Hope to meet you & your Lab one day...


myzanordin
ALPHA


Feb 22, 2008, 9:54 PM

Post #35 of 60 (2468 views)
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Re: [robros] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Yup, I agree with Amber too on training. Not that is a must, but it is for the betterment of the furkid. My min. pin has improved a lot from what he was 6 mths ago. Training not only bond handler and dog but also a good way to socialise your furkids'.

Robros, yes, I have seen many rotties who are so gentle. In fact, one of Basco's classmate is a Rottie. Very patient and gentle. Saw it licking one of the classmate that day. In fact, one of the silky was such a barker and ready to attack, but, the Rottie was so cool bout it.. I guess, its the training that helps them to relax and obey....(hmm...but I wonder, y it did work on the Silky though...ha ha ha )

Small breed (tend to exagerate, like mine lah) ..but with the training, they learn to LEAVE.....(ignore and behave when asked to)...Its true, training does help. But, handler needs a bit of commitment too. Dont just expect things to change overnite, the least 5 min. practise a day, to refresh their memory.....or sharpen the skill...

I work long hours too...but try as much to practise before and after work...Some dogs learn faster, some are slow and stubborn..handlers have to be patience and jgn cepat putus asa.....


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 26, 2008, 6:10 AM

Post #36 of 60 (2433 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Laughwell, my furkid's first day to school.. it's terrible ! ahahaha... cause she's so curious that she can't pay attention to both the trainer and me... Pirate

and because she's black in colour, she "heat" up really fast.. hahah.. so, after heeling for 2 round, she'll need to rest.. For the first day, she didn't do much.. but, she's damn tired!!! she needed water.. and I only brought a small bottle of water that day.. it was my fault.. I thought that she wouldn't want to drink when she's outside cause we did bring her to climb hills during weekends and she only drinks little of water for the trip..

by the way, cause we trained the dog outdoor.. not indoor.. plus it's 10 am in the morning and it's a sunny day.. so, my poor girl got no stamina at all.. so, only do very little traning that day.. learnt only the "heel" command.. ahhaha.. and she only did that when I had food in my hand... OMG.. Crazy

then, today, I tried to remind her the "heel" command.. so, practised with her .. you know what.. she doesn't really understand "heel".. but, she can understand when I say "walk" in hokkien.. ahhaha.. cause normally I talked to her in Hokkien.. so, she's a "hokkien" dog now.. and that's the problem to teach her heel in English now.. Pirate

by the way, will practise with her again tomorrow.. see what's the progression.. may be still the same.. only know food and hokkien.. don't understand "heel".. Laugh


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 27, 2008, 3:36 AM

Post #37 of 60 (2417 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Aiyoh, must bring enuf water one coz she's so black & can get overheated fast. Important to bring some cold ice water. To keep them cold, put them in a flask with few cubes or ice. We bring two every week...

It's her 1st day, don't worry. Sure thing dogs will not know what the heck you're saying. I mean, what's 'heel' to her? It's a new word she's learning. Actually, u to you to use any commands you want just as long you're doing the right thing & you do it right. If you want to use the command "walk", go ahead. What ever word that you think you're comfortable with it or your dog prefers, then use that word. Can be chinese too... But for your trainer, I don't know if he allows it. You try & ask him next week.

Take it slow with her. Always encourage her, don't tighten leash & strangle her I see many new students doing that to their dog. That will not teach the dog to heel with you properly. It's just forcing. So just loosen it to a u-shape & then if she moves out of place, goes forward or lags behind, encourage her to come close. Give a little tug & say "close" ow whatever.


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 27, 2008, 5:35 AM

Post #38 of 60 (2411 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

well, great news.. new improvement.. I'm so happy just now.. without a leash.. I tried it again with the "heel" word.. surprisingly, she really follow me, walk by my side.. just that not so close.. I will let her walk closer next time.. :) After walking for some time, I turn around, and she followed too.. Great !!! (my heart was screaming). .. then, after some walk, I said "sit".. and she really do.. so, I praised her.. I tried it for the 2nd and 3rd time.. she did it really well.. so, I finally rewarded her with a treat.. Sly


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 28, 2008, 12:50 AM

Post #39 of 60 (2376 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

That's good to hear! But don't celebrate too much yet. She just started learning. Doesn't mean she will heel off-leash perfectly with you now, means she will do it again next time. She will still need to be on leash. Right now, she's just following the treat in your hand. And that's good but you'll need a leash just for a back up. Use your voice as the leash (meaning encouragement, giving commands, etc)


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 28, 2008, 1:45 AM

Post #40 of 60 (2368 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

well, I went happy too early.. hahaha..Laugh know what, I found out that she hates the choke chain.. Pirateshe keeps biting the new leash and the choke chain while walking during the practice just now.. Unsure may be she just doesn't get use to the choke chain.. and it's not comfortable... Hope that by practising, she'll get used to the choke chain.. Unsure


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 28, 2008, 2:31 AM

Post #41 of 60 (2361 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, dogs wearing choke chains for the 1st time will not like it & will either pull away from it or will not walk at all. But doesn't mean when she's like this, you let her get away with it. Put it on & then let her wear it for a few days. When putting it on, reward & praise her. Tell her that the choke chain does no harm. Everytime you train her, put it on to remind her that it is training time. When leashing it, try not to put any pressure on it. Does she pull on it? If she doesn't, then no jerking is required. Just get her attention a3ay from the lead & choke chain by asking her to 'heel' beside you with the treat in your hand luring her. Take it slow...


PSY
K9 Kaki


Feb 28, 2008, 4:15 AM

Post #42 of 60 (2358 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Wow, glad things are back to normal, been busy but I think we manage to get the point home about "time management".... you know spending more time with the dogs.

You are right about training, never let your dog dominate you, for certain breed, once you let them you will never get it train.


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 28, 2008, 6:52 AM

Post #43 of 60 (2350 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

er... may I know the right way to put on the choke chain?? cause I suspect that I put wrongly..Blush that's why she hates it so much..

she pull the choke chain, that's why she's uncomfortable...

I tried to use food to get her attention..then, she kept jumping and tried to get the food from my hand.. Pirate I said no to her.. but, she kept doing that.. by the way, ended up walking side by side with me (but need some time to get her calm down and walk with me) and I rewarded her with her treat...


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 28, 2008, 7:17 AM

Post #44 of 60 (2348 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

Oh, putting the choke chain the right way is very important or else it will just straggle or hurt the dog. You'll have to make it into a 'P' shape. It's quite hard to explain here so just go online & do a research on how to put on choke chain on dog. It's very simple. It must also be smooth & that it should be easy to release the pressure on her neck.

When she keeps on jumping, stop & stand still. Hold the treat in your hand & look away, ignoring her UNTIL she calms down & sit. Then only you reward her. You want that behaviour, you don't want to encourage her to keep on jumping on you. After that you can continue doing heeling with her. She keeps jumping again, do the same thing again. Stop & ignore.

She's just excited about the treat & there's nothing wrong with that. The whole idea is you want her to get excited about her treat but at the same time, you want her to perform properly. Not jumping up & down like a hooligan! Perform & finish the exercise properly & then you can reward her. That's the way to do it...


(This post was edited by Amber.Faith on Feb 28, 2008, 7:23 AM)


mickey123
Enthusiast


Feb 29, 2008, 5:24 AM

Post #45 of 60 (2313 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks for the tips.. I just got the pic showing me the correct way of putting the choke chain..

I also forgot the way i put the choke chain the day before.. hahaha.. don't know it's the correct way or not.. by the way, I just tried the correct way, and she's ok with it .. not really hates it any more.. still bit it for a while.. but, after that, she's ok already..Laugh

so, I might be putting the wrong way for her during last practise time.. hahahaha...


Amber.Faith
Old Kaki


Feb 29, 2008, 7:49 AM

Post #46 of 60 (2304 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

How come the trainer didn't check ah? Usually trainers will check all the new students' dogs' choke chains to make sure they were put the right way...Anyway, just remember to put it on the right way everytime & only put it on during training time, no matter at home or at the training grounds.


mickey123
Enthusiast


Mar 1, 2008, 5:22 AM

Post #47 of 60 (2288 views)
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Re: [Amber.Faith] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

oh.. actually it's not the trainer's fault.. it's me that forgot which is the correct way of putting it on..

I didn't buy any choke chain on that first training day.. so, the trainer did show me the correct way of using choke chain.. but, it's me that confused.. hahaha.. so, my poor little fella suffered when I practised at home.. Blush


chrisong
Doggyman

Mar 1, 2008, 5:51 AM

Post #48 of 60 (2284 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

After many years in traininig my dogs in OB & Dog Show. I have realised that it is not necessary to use a choke chain collar to choke a dog in order to teach him something. Many dogs resent or fear the choking sensation. This does not put the dog in a good frame of mind to learn. The choke chain collar also called a strangle collar is a potentially dangerous tool. Since its uses are limited, I do not view the choke chain collar as a collar of choice.

The collar is used primarily to guide the dog not correct him. You can either use leather collar or wide buckle collar on your dog. By allowing the dog a chance to response on leather or buckle collar, you preserve his sensitivity. In the end the dog must response because you told him to not because of what collar he is wearing. Once the dog is off leash, the collar is useless.

What choke chain collar can do to your dog - http://www.uwsp.edu/.../dog/LA/hawgood1.htm


mickey123
Enthusiast


Mar 1, 2008, 11:29 PM

Post #49 of 60 (2257 views)
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Re: [chrisong] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks for the info.. after reading that, know how scary it is if I misuse the choke chain..

I think I'll only use the choke chain during the training time (and try not to choke her) cause it's requested by the trainer..Unsure I'll be more carefull while training...

She has her own collar (not leather but the wide buckle collar with a bell.. hahaha.. cause she's too quite without a bell and you won't know if she's doing something bad...).. only put on the choke chain when she's having her training.. :)


Amanda85
Doggyman


Mar 6, 2008, 10:52 PM

Post #50 of 60 (2190 views)
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Re: [mickey123] Beauty & Brains [In reply to] Can't Post

a positive way to teach heeling is use treat/toy/encouragement to make your dog follow u by your side....or keep dropping treats to her mouth when she's heeling (this help to get her heel close by your side)....and a way can make her pay attention to the owner rather than looking at other places while she's heeling...

use treats that is small, so that she doesn't need to stop to chew it...

'overdose' of pulling and tugging the leash and force your dog to follow u will only make the dog dislike training session...

some dogs simply shut down and do all the training in a reluctant mood...

when u doesn't agree with some of the trainer's method, don't force yourself to comply with it, afterall u are the one paying the fees

Pacco de Mongrel
~ Come and join us for a doggie jungle trekking @ Bukit Gasing every Saturday morning ~


(This post was edited by Amanda85 on Mar 6, 2008, 10:55 PM)

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